Many Minds cover art

Many Minds

Many Minds

By: Kensy Cooperrider – Diverse Intelligences Summer Institute
Listen for free

Our world is brimming with beings—human, animal, and artificial. We explore how they think, sense, feel, and learn. Conversations and more, every two weeks.Diverse Intelligences Summer Institute 2020-2025 Science
Episodes
  • The sparkling deep

    The sparkling deep
    Jun 20 2026
    It's tempting to see bioluminescence as an oddity, one of those rare eccentricities of life on earth. And, on land, maybe that's true. But our planet is mostly water, and out in the open ocean bioluminescence is utterly commonplace. Creatures of all shapes and sorts sparkle and glow, glitter and pulse. But what are these displays for? Why did they evolve? How did light become the currency of the deep? My guest today is Dr. Sönke Johnsen. Sönke is a Distinguished Professor of Biology at Duke University, where he and his research group study the visual ecology of the ocean. He's the author of a number of books: most recently Into the Great Wide Ocean, about life in the pelagic realm, and The Radiant Sea, a photographic tour of bioluminescence and color, written in collaboration with Dr. Steven Haddock. Here, Sönke and I talk about the open ocean: the most common habitat on our plant, yet one that many people will never experience. We consider the curious distribution of bioluminescence— rare on land, exceptionally prevalent in the ocean, and all but absent in freshwater. We talk about how bioluminescence seems to have evolved—many, many times over in fact. We survey the functions of making light in the deep—from counter-illumination to courtship to revenge. Finally, we consider what Sönke takes to be the biggest remaining puzzle about bioluminescence at sea. Alright friends, if you're enjoying Many Minds, we ask (humbly) if you would think about rating us, reviewing us, leaving us a comment, boosting us on social media, or perhaps haranguing your friends—relentlessly—until they give us a listen. Without further ado, onto my conversation with Dr. Sönke Johnsen. Enjoy! Notes 3:30 – The scientific report by Dr. Johnsen and colleagues describing the bioluminescent octopus, Stauroteuthis syrtensis. 12:00 – A popular article on the bristlemouth. The article reports a scientist's estimate of "as many as a dozen [bristlemouths] per square meter of ocean." 15:00 – A recent discussion of the "burglar alarm hypothesis." 18:00 – The website for the Johnsen Lab at Duke University. 24:00 – A chart and discussion of the depth zones of the ocean. 29:30 – A study by Séverine Martin and Steven Haddock quantifying the prevalence of bioluminescence at different depths. A popular write-up of the same study. 33:00 – A popular article on vertical migration in the ocean, also called "diel vertical migration." A recent scientific study of the phenomenon. 39:00 – A recent article on the evolution of bioluminescence. 45:00 – For detailed scientific discussion of the physical basis of bioluminescence, fluorescence, and other phenomena we discuss, see Dr. Johnson's book, The Optics of Life. 52:00 – For previous episodes on the use of sound in the animal kingdom, see here and here. For our previous episode on electroreception and electric ecology (including in marine organisms), see here. 57:00 – For more on the functions of bioluminescence, see here. For a report of a recently discovered function of bioluminescence, see here. 1:03:00 – An article by Dr. Johnsen about the different colors of bioluminescence present in the deep sea. 1:05:00 – A video of ostracod mating displays. 1:08:00 – For our recent episode on cave art, see here. 1:16:00 – For our earlier episode on firefly synchronization, see here. Recommendations Website and review article by Steven Haddock The lab of Todd Oakley Below the edge of darkness, Edie Widder Many Minds is a project of the Diverse Intelligences Summer Institute, which is made possible by a generous grant from the John Templeton Foundation to Indiana University. The show is hosted and produced by Kensy Cooperrider, with help from Assistant Producer Urte Laukaityte and with creative support from DISI Directors Erica Cartmill and Jacob Foster. Our artwork is by Ben Oldroyd. Subscribe to Many Minds on Apple, Stitcher, Spotify, Pocket Casts, Google Play, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also now subscribe to the Many Minds newsletter here! We welcome your comments, questions, and suggestions. Feel free to email us at: manymindspodcast@gmail.com. For updates about the show, visit our website or follow us on Bluesky (@manymindspod.bsky.social).
    Show More Show Less
    1 hr and 20 mins
  • Is Man the Hunter just a myth?

    Is Man the Hunter just a myth?
    Jun 5 2026
    There's a story about of our past that you know well. It goes like this: At some point earlier in human evolution, we started to hunt. Men in particular—perhaps channeling some deep-seated aggressive impulses—began to seek out big game. This new food source, this bonanza of calories, was what allowed our brains to expand. It changed our bodies and our societies and sent our species off on a whole new track. In short, Man the Hunter made us human. This story—told in different versions, with different points of emphasis—has circulated for decades. It's been debunked and revived, rejected and reimagined. What is the history behind the Man the Hunter idea? How does it square with our current understandings of evolution? Is it, in fact, pure fiction? My guest today is Dr. Vivek Venkataraman. Vivek is an evolutionary anthropologist at the University of Calgary, and an editor-in-chief of the journal Hunter Gatherer Research. He and his collaborators recently published an article on the different layers and meanings of the Man the Hunter idea. Here, Vivek and I lay out those meanings. We talk about how the phrase refers, first, to that popular myth about our evolution, but also to a landmark scientific conference in the 1960s, and to a major finding of research on contemporary hunter-gatherer groups—namely, that men generally do do most of the hunting. We do a little crash-course on the field of hunter-gatherer research, including the kinds of questions it asks and frameworks it uses. We dig into some of the key ingredients of the Man the Hunter myth: the idea that we have aggressive tendencies, the idea that only men hunt, and the idea that hunting played a transformative role in our evolution. We walk through three recent, high-profile studies challenging Man the Hunter ideas in various ways. And we talk about the ever-present danger of projecting our current norms and ideals back in time. Along the way, Vivek and I touch on 2001: A Space Odyssey; reasons why contemporary hunter-gatherers may differ from the hunter-gatherers of long ago; giant sloths; extractive foraging; the case of the Agta, a society in which women do engage in big-game hunting; the forest people and the fierce people; risk and cooperation in sexual divisions of labor; persistence hunting and endurance activities; caregiving and cognition; and honey. Alright friends, I think you'll enjoy this one. On to my conversation with Dr. Vivek Venkataraman. Notes 3:30 – The article by Dr. Venkataraman and colleagues, 'The Meaning and Dividends of Man the Hunter.' Commentaries on the article can be read here. A recent popular essay by Dr. Venkataraman on the same ideas. 5:00 – Raymond Dart's "killer ape" was originally laid out in a 1953 article 'The Predatory Transition from Ape to Man' (unavailable online) and then developed in Robert Ardrey's book, African Genesis. 8:30 – The "dawn of man" scene from 2001: A Space Odyssey. 16:00 – The 1966 conference titled 'Man the Hunter' resulted in a 1968 volume of the same name. 27:00 – A philosophical discussion of the use of the "ethnographic analogy" in reconstructions of the past. The paper describing the "tyranny of the ethnographic record." 33:00 – The classic ethnography, The Forest People; the classic ethnography, Yanomamö: The Fierce People. 36:00 – The article by Chris Boehm on the concept of "reverse dominance hierarchy." See also his book Hierarchy in the Forest. 37:00 – Our earlier episode with Brian Hare. 38:00 – Steven Pinker's widely read and contested book, The Better Angels of our Nature. 44:00 – A study of the Agta, a society in which women hunt for big game. 48:00 – The paper by Judith Brown about childcare and subsistence. A paper by Haneul Jang and colleagues about how young girls help mothers during foraging. 55:00 – For a book-length treatment of hunting in evolution and history, see Matt Cartmill's A View to a Death in the Morning. 1:01:00 – For the 2023 paper by Anderson and colleagues on the prevalence of women's hunting across cultures, see here. For Dr. Venkataraman and colleagues' commentary on the paper, see here. For the related study by Dr. Venkataraman and colleagues about women's hunting, see here. 1:05:00 – For the 2020 paper by Haas and colleagues about female hunters of the Americas, see here. 1:13:00 – For the academic 'Woman the Hunter' papers by Lacy and Ocobock, see here (for the physiology paper) and here (for the archaeology paper). For their article in Scientific American, see here. For an interview on the podcast On Humans with Cara Ocobock, see here. 1:14:00 – For the recent study on persistence hunting in the ethnographic record, see here. 1:20:00 – The authors of the three critiques discussed here have all written commentaries on Dr. Venkataraman and colleagues' paper. These commentaries and others can be read here. 1:24:30 – For the commentary emphasizing the links ...
    Show More Show Less
    1 hr and 32 mins
  • Babies, dogs, and the riddles of word learning

    Babies, dogs, and the riddles of word learning
    May 22 2026
    It's kind of astonishing, really, that kids ever learn words. Each one poses a little riddle. Does this sound string refer to a person? A category of things? Or maybe some other feature of the blooming, buzzing world? And yet word learning happens. In fact, we now know it begins earlier in infancy than we realized. And we now know, further, that dogs (or at least some dogs) understand words as well. So how does this happen? What do babies and dogs really know about words? And how might we go about figuring this all out? My guests today are Dr. Elika Bergelson and Dr. Claudia Fugazza. Elika is an Associate Professor in the Department of Psychology at Harvard University, where her lab studies how infants learn language. Claudia is a Researcher at Eötvös Loránd University in Hungary, where she and her collaborators study dogs who are especially gifted word learners. In this conversation, Elika, Claudia, and I talk about the thorny question of what it means to understand a word—and whether there are different degrees or kinds of understanding. We consider the challenges posed by different types of words—by nouns, by names, by verbs, by function words, size terms, and more. We discuss why it is that some dogs are so good at learning words, and why infants of a certain age seem to get so much better at it. We talk about learning in different contexts and situations. And we circle the question of how different word learning really is in dogs and babies. Alright friends, before we get to it, one tiny ask: If you've been enjoying Many Minds, you can help us grow by leaving a review or comment or a rating, or by sharing us with a friend or colleague. We would greatly appreciate the support! Without further ado, on to my interview with Claudia Fugazza and Elika Bergelson. Enjoy! Notes 3:30 – A paper on infants' understanding of proper nouns like "Mommy." 6:00 – For our earlier audio essay on names across the animal kingdom, see here. 11:00 – For Dr. Bergelson's early study showing that 6-month-old infants already understand the meanings of some words, see here. 13:30 – For more on the "comprehension boost" in infants after age one, see Dr. Elika's paper here. 16:30 – For Dr. Fugazza and colleagues' first studies on gifted word-learning dogs, see here and here. 20:00 – See earlier studies on Rico and Chaser. 24:00 – For more on the qualitative changes that infants may undergo as they learn to learn words, see a paper by Dr. Bergelson and a colleague here. 30:00 – A study by Dr. Fugazza and colleagues comparing personality profiles and playfulness of gifted word learner dogs and typical dogs. 31:30 – A recent New York Times article consoling readers that having a "dumb" (i.e., non-gifted) dog is okay. 39:30 – A study by Dr. Fugazza and colleagues showing that dogs can extend labels of toys ("pull," "fetch") to new objects that are used in the same way. 43:00 – A study by Dr. Bergelson and a colleague on how broadly (or narrowly) infants apply labels like "foot" or "juice." A study by Dr. Bergelson and colleagues looking at how familiarity affects infants' understanding of words. 52:00 – For an example of a study on the so-called noun bias in early word learning, see here. For work on the (lack of) a noun bias in Tseltal infants, see here. For a sample discussion of the so-called shape bias, see here. 54:00 – For Dr. Fugazza and colleagues' work on dogs' biases toward shape or texture when generalizing about objects, see here. 57:00 – For the work by Asifa Majid (former guest!) on odor words in Jahai, see here. For the work on scent-tracking in humans, see here. 1:02:00 – On "dog-directed speech" and its consequences, see here and here. For comparisons of dog- and infant-directed speech, see here and here. 1:04:00 – For the study finding that Tseltal-speaking children learn honorific terms (which are never addressed to them), see here. 1:06:00 – For the study by Dr. Fugazza and colleagues, "examining exclusion-based choice" in dogs, see here. For the study by Dr. Fugazza and colleagues showing that gifted word learner dogs can learn by over-hearing labels, see here. 1:10:00 – For the study showing that children seem to request labels for objects by pointing to them, see here. 1:12:00 – For some of the first scientific studies on the use of soundboards for communication in dogs, see here and here. For our earlier episode with Dr. Federico Rossano discussing some of this research, see here. Recommendations 'The Invention of Language by Children,' by Lila Gleitman and Elissa Newport 'Concept-based word learning in human infants,' by Jun Yin and Gergely Csibra 'Syntactic bootstrapping as a mechanism for language learning,' by Mireille Babineau et al. The Genius Dog Challenge YouTube channel Many Minds is a project of the Diverse Intelligences Summer Institute, which is made possible by a generous grant from the John Templeton ...
    Show More Show Less
    1 hr and 19 mins
adbl_web_anon_alc_button_suppression_t1
No reviews yet