Don Lemon was one of the first journalists that “pissed Trump off,” Nicolle charges out of the gate. A year and a half into the president’s second term, the independent journalist and former CNN anchor is upfront about President Trump’s waning energy, noting that his “battery is fading” and that what happened at MSG during Game Three was a vibe shift: “I think that there'll be a reckoning,  and I think that that reckoning started at Madison Square Garden with the boos.” Operating independently as the host of "The Don Lemon Show" since 2023, Don joins Nicolle this week to talk about the freedom he has now to meet people where they are, amplifying voices that often get lost in the national conversation. Don also shares the backstory of his arrest and subsequent federal charges after covering a protest in a Minneapolis church earlier this year. But for Don, the volatile political climate only means that the pendulum will, inevitably, swing back. “Something good is going to happen to America — and, I believe, the world,” he says, “because of all this turmoil that we're in right now.”

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Liz Oyer understands the transactional nature of the current Justice Department more than most. In March of 2025, she was fired from her position as the US Pardon Attorney for refusing to reinstate actor Mel Gibson’s gun rights. Since then, she’s talked openly about her time in the DOJ and its unceremonious end and she's been targeted by Acting Attorney General Todd Blanche as a result. Still, she continues to shine a light on the abuses within the department she once revered. She joins Nicolle this week for a sober diagnosis of the ways in which Trump has “perverted” her former office and the crucial need to rebuild the public trust in the years ahead. “I don't think anyone ever imagined a president who would say, ‘It's my interests first. What's in the interest of the public isn't primary...’ And that's what Donald Trump has done that's so new and different, and that our laws really aren't built for.” And while Oyer is wide-eyed about the grift within the Trump administration, she is also optimistic that this is an opportunity: “I'd like to be part of the rebuilding in the future... to make it an institution that better serves the American people.”

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Bob Costas believes democracy is worth going to bat for. The legendary sportscaster and 12-time host of NBC’s Olympics coverage is no stranger to speaking up when the moment calls — which, as he tells Nicolle this week, is rare: 99.9% of the time he is calling balls and strikes. But when Bob finds an “interstitial moment” to talk about an issue in the zeitgeist (think: domestic violence, CTE from repeated concussions, or recognizing the racially charged name of a pro-team) he is unafraid to use his voice and his platform to speak truth to power. And this moment is no different.

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Ben Rhodes believes “we’ve lost the art of speaking to one another.” Amid the megaphone of social media sound bites and the ever-increasing coarseness of our politics, the speechwriter and former Obama Deputy National Security Advisor identifies something that can make or break us: communication. He joins Nicolle this week to talk about his new book, “All We Say,” which tells the story of America through 15 of its most pivotal speeches. From Benjamin Franklin’s carefully crafted argument at the Constitutional Convention to FDR’s “Four Freedoms” speech that defined a national identity on the precipice of a world war, to Barack Obama’s bold address on race in America, Ben traces the uniquely American spirit that lives through the words that have changed the course of history. And while leaders like Vice President JD Vance seek to divide with rhetoric, Ben sees promise in young leaders who are telling a compelling story and painting a clear picture of the America they envision. “The best speakers,” Ben tells Nicolle, “build movements.”

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Ken Burns thinks we’re going to make it. An award-winning documentarian, Ken’s celebrated career seeks to find humanity in our country’s imperfect story. He threads this idea through his documentaries about everything from our national pastime (“Baseball”), to our offbeat experiments (“Jazz”), and our violent beginnings as seen through his latest project, “The American Revolution.” As our nation's 250th anniversary approaches, he joins Nicolle at 92NY for an intimate conversation about the American experiment — how its failures and its successes inform each other and nudge the country forward. Ken understands that political turmoil is a hallmark of our democracy; fundamentally, we’ve been here before. To illustrate this, he shares the words of a German Hessian soldier spoken as he surrenders at Yorktown: “Who would have thought a hundred years ago that out of this multitude of rabble could arise a people who could defy kings?”

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Chris Hayes’ antidote to anxiety is always curiosity. Whether on TV with "All In," on his podcast (aptly named “Why Is This Happening?”), or writing about our waning attention spans in his latest book, he looks to make sense of this era’s firehose of information by seeking out the reasons behind the very human decisions we make. This curiosity prompted a deep dive series on his podcast into artificial intelligence: "The AI End Game," tracing AI's evolution to how it will impact our democracy and what guardrails need to be applied. This week, Chris joins Nicolle to talk about how Democrats can rebuild faith in government in a “low trust” democracy, what we can learn from our political past “while not being obsessed with it and trapped in it” and what deeper questions we should be asking about AI. And in his search to understand this technology, he discovered an unintended source of inspiration because “it brings us back in some ways to what we find beautiful and thrilling about being human.”

Search "Why Is This Happening? The Chris Hayes Podcast" to listen to the full series, "The AI End Game."

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

AI – and coverage of it – is everywhere. But what is artificial intelligence, really, beyond the buzzword? Each week, in a special new miniseries - ‘The AI End Game’ - Chris Hayes is joined by preeminent experts on AI and its effects to help make sense of this revolutionary time in history.

The series will feature in-depth conversations with experts, including: The Atlantic journalist Derek Thompson; professor at Wharton and New York Times bestselling author Ethan Mollick, professor of psychology at UC Berkeley and member of the Berkeley AI Research Group Alison Gopnik; former co-lead of the Ethical Artificial Intelligence Team at Google and co-founder of Black in AI Timnit Gebru; philosopher and cognitive scientist David Chalmers; author, host of the “Better Offline” podcast and writer of the “Where's Your Ed At” newsletter, Ed Zitron; The New York Times journalist and author, Michael Pollan, and more. The first episode is available now wherever you get your podcasts.

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Sarah Longwell listens to voters. As a GOP strategist and pollster who felt herself languishing in the wilderness as Trump 1.0 took root, she founded “The Bulwark” in 2019 with a stated mission “to put country over party... and to build a home for the politically homeless.” This masthead has become a movement, and Sarah, its fearless leader, sees defending democracy as the quintessential goal. After leading voter focus groups for the last eight years, Sarah understands that what matters in the beltway ‘bubble” rarely translates to what matters to America’s median voter, and why Trump’s approval is flailing: “People know that the tariffs are Trump’s, people know that the Iran war is Trump's... and that it is raising their prices, and that is what they are mad about.” Sarah uses these insights to chart a path for how Americans can move past the MAGA movement and take the “weird” out of government again. She joins Nicolle for a conversation about the power of simply listening to voters, how the two wings of the MAGA movement are fraying, and what Democrats can do to capitalize on Trump’s failures.

And a note to listeners: Last chance to get tickets for a live taping of "The Best People" with iconic documentarian Ken Burns at the 92Y in New York City. It’s happening on Tuesday, May 12th. You can learn more here: https://stage.92ny.org/event/ken-burns-and-nicolle-wallace

Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content and early access to new episodes of "The Best People."

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.