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For a long time, freshwater experts thought of estuaries as just "the end of the river," while marine biologists dismissed them as "the bit where the sea comes in." But today, scientists realize that estuaries are incredibly complex, dynamic ecosystems in their own right.

In this episode of the Nature Recovery Podcast, Stephen is joined by world-renowned estuarine and coastal science expert, Professor Mike Elliott. They explore the fascinating, constantly fluctuating world of estuaries, the vital "ecotones" where rivers meet the sea.

Professor Elliott explains the "triple whammy" of pressures facing global coastlines, the difference between contamination and pollution, and introduces the concept of the "Emerald Economy." He also breaks down the DAPSI(W)R(M) framework for solving complex environmental challenges, proving that when we relieve the pressures on these dynamic systems, nature can, and does, bounce back.

Key Topics Covered:

• What actually makes an estuary an ecosystem in its own right?
• The "Estuarine Quality Paradox" and how organisms survive extreme environmental stress.
• Understanding the "Emerald Economy": Ecosystem services vs. Societal goods and benefits.
• The "Triple Whammy" threatening our coasts: industrialization, resource depletion, and climate change.
• Incredible recovery stories: How the dead Thames and Clyde estuaries were brought back to life.
• The DAPSI(W)R(M) framework: A roadmap for balancing human needs with natural systems.

Resources:

• Learn more about Professor Mike Elliott's work at the University of Hull and IECS Limited.

The Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery is interested in promoting a wide variety of views and opinions on nature recovery from researchers and practitioners.

The views, opinions and positions expressed within this podcast are those of the speakers alone, they do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of the Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery, or its researchers.

The work of the Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery is made possible thanks to the support of the Leverhulme Trust.

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In this episode of the Nature Recovery Podcast, Stephen Thomas speaks with Lee White about a remarkable life working across science, conservation, and government in central Africa. Lee reflects on growing up in Uganda, studying rainforest ecosystems in West Africa and Gabon, and how his scientific work led him into national park creation, forest policy, and international climate negotiations.

The conversation explores why the gap between scientific evidence and political action remains so wide, and why forests need to be understood not only as ecosystems but as economic and geopolitical systems. Lee explains how Gabon tried to make standing forests economically valuable through protected areas, sustainable forestry, and REDD+, and why that model faced both successes and setbacks.

They also discuss the Congo Basin as a global climate system, the importance of local and international science capacity, and the role of nature in human health, resilience, and wellbeing. The episode ends with a broader reflection on what nature recovery really means, from restoring cities and farmland to thinking at a planetary scale.

The Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery is interested in promoting a wide variety of views and opinions on nature recovery from researchers and practitioners.

The views, opinions and positions expressed within this podcast are those of the speakers alone, they do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of the Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery, or its researchers.

The work of the Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery is made possible thanks to the support of the Leverhulme Trust.

Send us Fan Mail

Hosted by Wallerand Bazin, a DPhil researcher in Geography and the Environment at Oxford whose work focuses on the political ecologies of climate and conservation in heritage landscapes.

In this episode of the Nature Recovery Podcast, Stephen Thomas and Wallerand Bazin speak with Guy Shrubsole about land ownership, stewardship, and the politics of nature recovery in Britain. Shrubsole traces the ideas behind Who Owns England?, The Lost Rainforest of Britain, and The Lie of the Land, and explains how his thinking developed through environmental campaigning, archival research, and fieldwork.

The conversation explores why land ownership remains so concentrated in England, why “stewardship” is often more rhetoric than reality, and why public funding for nature should be tied to stronger accountability. Shrubsole also discusses community land ownership in Scotland, the case for more transparency in land registry data, and how nature recovery needs to be understood through history, justice, and power as well as ecology.

The Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery is interested in promoting a wide variety of views and opinions on nature recovery from researchers and practitioners.

The views, opinions and positions expressed within this podcast are those of the speakers alone, they do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of the Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery, or its researchers.

The work of the Leverhulme Centre for Nature Recovery is made possible thanks to the support of the Leverhulme Trust.