In this episode of The Psychedelic Podcast, Paul F. Austin welcomes Steven C. Hayes, Ph.D., originator of Acceptance and Commitment Therapy, creator of Relational Frame Theory, and one of the most cited psychologists in the world.

Full Show Notes: https://thethirdwave.co/podcast/episode-363/?ref=278

Hayes reflects on his early experiences in the Summer of Love, why psychedelics were never meant to be treated as a party, and how those formative explorations helped shape his lifelong work on psychological flexibility.
Paul and Steven explore what psychedelics can reveal about the nature of self, the role of preparation and context in safe outcomes, and why psychedelic therapy must not be reduced to a patented, "script and go" biomedical model. Their conversation also examines ACT, trauma, attachment, group experience, spiritual community, and the importance of honoring each person's unique path rather than forcing transformation into averages, labels, or protocols.

Steven C. Hayes, Ph.D., is a Nevada Foundation Professor of Psychology Emeritus at the University of Nevada, Reno and President of the Institute for Better Health, a 45-year-old charitable organization that promotes quality in mental and behavioral health services. He is the originator of Acceptance and Commitment Therapy, creator of Relational Frame Theory, and a co-developer of Process-Based Therapy. Hayes has authored nearly 750 scientific articles and 48 books, including Get Out of Your Mind and Into Your Life and A Liberated Mind. His methods are distributed worldwide by the World Health Organization and other major scientific agencies, and are commonly used in psychedelic-assisted therapy. His TEDx talks and blogs have been viewed or read by more than five million people, and he is among the most cited psychologists in the world.

Highlights:

• Psychedelics as tools of the mind
• The Summer of Love's unfinished lessons
• Self as context and spiritual awareness
• Why good trips feel like coming home
• ACT as psychological flexibility
• Preparation, safety, and lasting change
• The danger of "script and go" psychedelics
• Group ceremony and relational healing
• Particularity, averages, and human uniqueness
• Psychedelics beyond the therapy frame

Episode Links:

• Steven's Website
• Steven on Medium
• Steven Instagram
• Steven on Linkedin

Episode Sponsors:

• The Practitioner Certification Program by Third Wave's Psychedelic Coaching Institute.
• Golden Rule - Get a lifetime discount of 10% with code THIRDWAVE at checkout

Third Wave occasionally partners with or shares information about other people, companies, and/or providers. While we work hard to only share information about ethical and responsible third parties, we can't and don't control the behavior of, products and services offered by, or the statements made by people, companies, or providers other than Third Wave. Accordingly, we encourage you to research for yourself, and consult a medical, legal, or financial professional before making decisions in those areas. Third Wave isn't responsible for the statements, conduct, services, or products of third parties. If we share a coupon code, we may receive a commission from sales arising from customers who use our coupon code. No one is required to use our coupon codes."

In this conversation, Paul F. Austin speaks with Dr. Dave Rabin, neuroscientist, board-certified psychiatrist, and co-founder of Apollo Neuroscience, about one of the most important questions in psychedelic work: why do some journeys become overwhelming, destabilizing, or difficult to integrate?

Find full show notes and links here: https://thethirdwave.co/podcast/episode-362/?ref=278

Dave explains why safety is not just a matter of set, setting, or a strong screening form. It is a physiological state in the nervous system. Together, Paul and Dave explore how fear, trauma, and dysregulation can shape a person's ability to receive and process a psychedelic experience, and why preparation must include a deeper understanding of the body.

The conversation also covers pre-session nervous system assessment, vagus nerve activity, HRV, haptic vibration, breathwork, therapeutic touch, consent, and the role of tools like Apollo Neuro in helping clients feel safe enough to surrender, process, and integrate.

Dr. David Rabin, MD, PhD, is a neuroscientist, board-certified psychiatrist, health-tech entrepreneur, and inventor who has studied the impact of chronic stress in humans for more than a decade. He is the co-founder and Chief Innovation Officer at Apollo Neuroscience, and co-founder and executive director of the Board of Medicine, a nonprofit organization establishing evidence-based clinical guidelines for the safe use of unregulated alternative medicines, including plant medicines. His research focuses on non-invasive therapies for treatment-resistant conditions, trauma recovery, psychedelic-assisted psychotherapy, and the neurobiology of belief.

Highlights:

• Why safety is physiological
• Beyond set and setting
• How fear interrupts healing
• Pre-session nervous system assessment
• MDMA and the safety cascade
• Haptic vibration and soothing touch
• HRV as a preparation signal
• Breathwork for embodied regulation
• Consent and therapeutic touch
• Scaling safe psychedelic care

Episode Links:

• Apollo Neuro
• Dr. Dave Rabin on Instagram
• Dr. Dave's Book, "A Simple Guide to Being Alive"

Episode Sponsors:

• The Practitioner Certification Program by Third Wave's Psychedelic Coaching Institute.
• The Microdosing Practitioner Certification at Psychedelic Coaching Institute.
• Golden Rule - Get a lifetime discount of 10% with code THIRDWAVE at checkout

These show links may contain affiliate links. Third Wave receives a small percentage of the product price if you purchase through the above affiliate links.

Disclaimer: This content is for educational, informational, and entertainment purposes only. We do not promote or encourage the illegal use of any controlled substances. Nothing said here is medical or legal advice. Always consult a qualified medical or mental health professional before making decisions related to your health. The views expressed herein belong to the speaker alone, and do not reflect the views of any other person, company, or organization.

Third Wave occasionally partners with or shares information about other people, companies, and/or providers. While we work hard to only share information about ethical and responsible third parties, we can't and don't control the behavior of, products and services offered by, or the statements made by people, companies, or providers other than Third Wave. Accordingly, we encourage you to research for yourself, and consult a medical, legal, or financial professional before making decisions in those areas. Third Wave isn't responsible for the statements, conduct, services, or products of third parties. If we share a coupon code, we may receive a commission from sales arising from customers who use our coupon code. No one is required to use our coupon codes.