Episodes

  • Order vs. Chaos – Who is thriving in a world of crisis?

    Order vs. Chaos – Who is thriving in a world of crisis?
    May 28 2026
    In a new book, Surviving Chaos: Geopolitics When the Rules Fail, co-founder and director of the European Council on Foreign Relations Mark Leonard argues that we have entered an age of ‘un-order’ – when the rules and norms of the international order no longer hold sway. Can democratic leaders find a way to meet the challenges of an era of widening conflict, geopolitical competition and political division? In today’s episode, Mark joins Gavin Esler to discuss a new age of instability, and asks who is best prepared to survive chaos, and how? Buy Surviving Chaos: Geopolitics When the Rules Fail through our affiliate bookshop and you’ll help fund the podcast by earning us a small commission for every sale. Bookshop.org’s fees help support independent bookshops too. • Support us on Patreon to keep This Is Not A Drill producing thought-provoking podcasts like this. Written and presented by Gavin Esler. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    35 mins
  • All guns blazing – How the arms trade went into overdrive

    All guns blazing – How the arms trade went into overdrive
    May 21 2026
    As drones and missiles darken the skies above conflicts in Ukraine and the Middle East, is a transformation in modern warfare leading to a new arms race? And as technology and tactics evolve, which weapons and defence systems are being bought, and who is buying them? Gavin Esler discusses the realities of the arms trade in 2026 with Pieter Wezeman, senior researcher in the Arms Transfers Programme at the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute. • Support us on Patreon to keep This Is Not A Drill producing thought-provoking podcasts like this. Written and presented by Gavin Esler. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    32 mins
  • Drone masters – How Ukraine reinvented modern warfare

    Drone masters – How Ukraine reinvented modern warfare
    May 14 2026
    Putin thought that Ukraine would quickly fold under a massively superior Russian onslaught. Instead, the War has seen Ukraine reinventing itself as a world expert in drone warfare, exploiting cheap replaceable tech and digital networks to strike deep and painfully into Russia. Ukraine now leads the world in the air defence expertise required in today’s conflict zones – and nations across Europe and the Middle East now consult Ukraine on the fast-evolving drone tech they need in today’s unstable world. Can Kyiv use drones to gain a significant advantage in the war? And what will it mean for future conflicts, the ethics of war, and international security? Oz Katerji looks at the new frontier of battlefield tech with journalist and associate research fellow at the Henry Jackson Society, David Kirichenko. • Support us on Patreon to keep This Is Not A Drill producing thought-provoking podcasts like this. Written and presented by Oz Katerji. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    37 mins
  • Poison arsenal – The deadly return of bioweapons

    Poison arsenal – The deadly return of bioweapons
    May 7 2026
    Though Saddam Hussein tried to develop them and North Korea is accused of stockpiling them, biological weapons have been considered taboo for decades. Theoretically they’re banned. But intelligence agencies and military leaders are increasingly warning of wider clandestine programmes to develop deadly mass toxins, and A.I. is lowering the barriers to entry dramatically. As governments scramble to keep up and frontier tech runs out of control, are we about to enter a new age of bioweapons and bioterrorism? Gavin Esler talks to Dr Cassidy Nelson, director of biosecurity policy at the Centre for Long-Term Resilience, about this rising threat and what we can do about it. Advertisers! Want to reach smart, engaged, influential people? Some 3.5 MILLION people download and watch our podcasts every month – and they love our shows. Why not get YOUR brand in front of our influential listeners with podcast advertising? Contact ads@podmasters.co.uk to find out more. • Support us on Patreon to keep This Is Not A Drill producing thought-provoking podcasts like this. Written and presented by Gavin Esler. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    26 mins
  • Inside Russia’s web of terror – How Kremlin proxies wreak havoc across Europe

    Inside Russia’s web of terror – How Kremlin proxies wreak havoc across Europe
    Apr 30 2026
    Acts of sabotage and arson spreading across Europe are persistently connected to Russia. Gavin Esler is joined by Shaun Walker, the Guardian's central and eastern Europe correspondent, to discuss the Kremlin’s shadow warfare network and the chaos state-sponsored terror is causing across the continent. • Advertisers! Want to reach smart, engaged, influential people? Some 3.5 MILLION people download and watch our podcasts every month – and they love our shows. Why not get YOUR brand in front of our influential listeners with podcast advertising? Contact ads@podmasters.co.uk to find out more. • Support us on Patreon to keep This Is Not A Drill producing thought-provoking podcasts like this. Written and presented by Gavin Esler. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    31 mins
  • America against the World Part 4 – The New Normal?

    America against the World Part 4 – The New Normal?
    Apr 27 2026
    The final episode of a four-part series from This Is Not A Drill… This time: International leaders cling to the idea that Trump’s violent overthrow of the world order and embrace of raw power will prove temporary. But what if it isn’t? What if we’ve entered a new age where might makes right? And after Iran and Venezuela, is there any coherent vision behind America’s new foreign policy – or is it just driven by anger and greed? Dr Célia Belin of the European Council on Foreign Relations explains how Trump has set out to remake the world in his own cynical image. And Richard Haass, former President of the Council on Foreign Relations and advisor to President George HW Bush, describes how Trump’s aggressive, values-free foreign policy means that if countries like Britain don’t band together, they must choose between submitting to America or cutting a deal with their enemies. • We hope you enjoyed this miniseries. Get fresh insights into geopolitics early when you back us Patreon. Written and presented by Gavin Esler. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    40 mins
  • America against the World Part 3 – Who will fill the Power Vacuum?

    America against the World Part 3 – Who will fill the Power Vacuum?
    Apr 23 2026
    A four-part series from This Is Not A Drill… Get the complete series now when you support us on Patreon. How will we cope with the end of the Pax Americana – and what comes next? This time: As Trump flips the table and walks away from America’s old international role, China want to take advantage. The People’s Republic is squaring up to the US on multiple fronts – economic, technological, cultural and potentially militarily. Sir Robin Niblett, author of The New Cold War, talks to Gavin Esler about whether China is as strong as it claims to be, the truth about the Sino-Russian relationship, and why this Cold War won’t be the same as the last one. And Ulrike Franke, German political analyst and fellow at the European Council on Foreign Relations, looks at what’s left of the old international order. • The final episode of America against the World is out on Monday 27 April. Get it right now when you support us on Patreon. Written and presented by Gavin Esler. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    31 mins
  • America against the World Part 2 – Is Washington pulling the world apart?

    America against the World Part 2 – Is Washington pulling the world apart?
    Apr 20 2026
    A new four-part series from This Is Not A Drill… Get the complete series now when you support us on Patreon. How will we cope with the end of Pax Americana – and what comes next? Gavin Esler dives deep into a harsh new era of international relations. In this second episode, has Trump broken the trust-based world order – or just exposed it? Are we building a hostile world of fortresses? What would NATO look like without the US? Ukrainian journalist and author Nataliya Gumenyuk explains how Trump risks making America irrelevant in the world. Kori Schake of the American Enterprise Institute describes how MAGA is actively driving democracies away from America. And Dr Rebecca Harding of the Centre for Economic Security argues that Trump’s tariffs and America’s attacks on the rule of law amount to a world economic war. • Episode 3 is out on Thursday 23 April. Follow us so you don’t miss it. Written and presented by Gavin Esler. Produced by Robin Leeburn. Original theme music by Paul Hartnoll – https://www.orbitalofficial.com. Executive Producer Martin Bojtos. Managing Editor Jacob Jarvis. Group Editor Andrew Harrison. This Is Not A Drill is a Podmasters production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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    38 mins