Trump’s SAVE Act is being sold as a straightforward push for election integrity, but in this episode, we take a look at why it is not nearly that simple. On the surface, secure elections sound like an easy thing to support. But once you get into the details, the conversation becomes much more complicated. Is this really about protecting the vote, or is it about raising suspicion and adding new barriers just before the midterms?

Nicole shares why her instinct is that the SAVE Act feels like a pre-midterm power move wrapped in the language of fairness. Jolene sees the appeal of a more standardized voting system, and both agree that public trust in elections matters. They also agree that handing too much control to the federal government comes with real risks, especially when centralised voter systems can create new vulnerabilities and new opportunities for overreach.

The episode also digs into the practical impact of laws like this. What happens to people in rural areas, people without easy access to updated documents, women whose names do not match old paperwork, or communities that already face barriers to voting? Nicole argues that access is part of election integrity too, and that a system is not truly secure if it quietly pushes legitimate voters out of the process.

At the heart of the conversation is a bigger question about democracy itself. If the goal is a better voting system, why are reforms so often introduced in the most politically explosive way possible? Why not build trust slowly, with time, support, and real buy-in from both sides? Nicole and Jolene ask what meaningful voter reform should actually look like, and how we protect both security and access without turning every election conversation into a loyalty test.

CHAPTER MARKERS:

00:00 Welcome

00:26 What Is the SAVE Act

00:58 Liberal Hot Takes

03:47 Conservative Breakdown

05:18 ID Requirements Debate

07:20 Real ID Rollout Idea

14:21 How Registration Would Work

17:21 Immigration Fraud Claims

21:20 Bipartisanship and Funding

25:09 Midterms and Loopholes

26:54 Voter Rolls and Turnout

29:32 Bipartisan Wins Ignored

30:47 Name Changes and IDs

32:50 Registration Versus Voting

35:46 Politics and Fraud Claims

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

https://campaignlegal.org/update/what-you-need-know-about-save-act

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/

Iran is one of the most loaded topics on the planet right now, and in this episode, Nicole (liberal) and Jolene (conservative) try to talk about it without pretending it’s simple. We recorded on Thursday, March 5th, fully aware that modern conflict moves fast and anything we say could age in a week. So this isn’t a “perfect take.” It’s us slowing the conversation down and naming what we know, what we don’t, and what we’re tempted to assume.

Jolene opens with three hot takes, starting with the language. Five days in, she hesitates to call it a “war” and frames it as a conflict, not to minimise it, but because words shape expectations. “War” implies a timeline, a scale, and a level of commitment Americans are deeply wary of after Iraq and Afghanistan. She also wrestles with the tension between short-term necessity and long-term fallout, including what it signals to allies and adversaries if the U.S. hesitates, and what it costs if the U.S. gets pulled into something with no clear end.

Nicole also gets stuck on the war versus conflict question, because labels shape what people tolerate and demand. We talk about the strategic side too, including the role of allies, technology, and how modern warfare has shifted toward precision, drones, cyber, intelligence, and targeted strikes. But underneath all of it is the question that never goes away: what is the plan? “Winning” is not clean, and moral certainty can become a shortcut that avoids the hard questions while real people pay the price.

We also centre the part that can’t be treated like a chessboard: the Iranian people. We talk about the human cost already paid by protestors and ordinary citizens under an oppressive regime, and the uncomfortable questions about intervention, democracy, and what happens after a regime is weakened.

Finally, we dig into the media layer and why “stay curious” matters more than ever. What are you watching? What are you worried about? What do you think the U.S. responsibility is here, if any? Drop your thoughts in the comments and keep it respectful.

CHAPTER MARKERS:

00:00 Welcome

00:25 Iran Conflict

01:10 Jolene Three Hot Takes

03:31 Allies And Drones

04:16 No Long Term Plan

05:16 Human Cost And Protest

07:09 How We Got Here

10:25 Be Curious Learn History

12:38 Kurds And Civil War Risk

14:58 War Powers And Congress

18:22 Moral Cost Of Strikes

21:10 What Happens After

23:35 Succession and Assassination

23:54 Intel Infiltration Strategy

25:40 Iran Threats and Trump

26:27 Israel Discourse and Antisemitism

27:15 Hamas and Campus Protests

29:15 Iran Voices on Instagram

31:05 Media Fear and Polling

33:38 Who Builds a New Middle East

35:48 Would You Rather War Outcomes

37:50 Noem Jet and Lewandowski

41:36 Podcast Wrap

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Instagram: @hemdad.nazari

https://youtu.be/e9dljIL4rBk?si=q0Jjj5oN2uDcJPPg

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/

Politics lately feels less like governing and more like bad behavior. In this episode, we ask a simple question: where did basic political decorum go, and why does it feel like the whole country is running on outrage and adrenaline?

We talk about congressional hearings that feel more like theatre than truth-seeking, including the Pam Bondi exchange during the Epstein hearings. Tough questions are part of the job, but the posturing, rehearsed lines, and made-for-camera moments leave us wondering who the real audience is. When oversight becomes performance, it doesn’t just waste time. It teaches the public that politics is about winning the clip, not solving problems.

We also unpack how modern media and social platforms amplify the worst incentives. Sensational headlines, rage-bait framing, and constant “gotcha” coverage keep everyone stressed, divided, and exhausted. We ask whether changes like removing cameras from hearings or tightening rules could reduce the made-for-TV drama, while still protecting transparency.

Finally, we look at what “adult discourse” could sound like again, including our reaction to Marco Rubio’s Munich speech, and the bigger tension between relatability and responsibility in leadership. We also talk about the double standard women face in public life, where forcefulness is praised in men and punished in women. If you’re exhausted too, tell us in the comments. What would you reward in a leader if the algorithm wasn’t in the room?

CHAPTER MARKERS:

00:00 Introduction

00:25 Decorum In Politics in Disappearing

02:07 Hearings As Theater

02:26 Tabloid Media Machine

06:08 Fixing The Congressional Hearing Format

07:41 Pam Bondi Performing For Trump

09:59 Rubio Munich Adult In Room

12:34 JD Vance Speech Comparison

13:17 Rubio Then And Now

14:46 What Calm Leadership Feels Like

16:10 Outrage Gets Attention

16:42 Trump Reads The Room

19:22 Authentic Not Rude

21:09 Women And Double Standards

26:13 Rage Bait And Civility

26:59 Modeling Respectful Debate

28:16 Would You Rather Segment

30:56 Closing Thoughts

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

https://www.foxnews.com/media/how-pam-bondi-democrats-turned-hearing-hysteria-right-front-jeffrey-epsteins-victims

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/

We’re sitting down with Brad Porteus, the creator of Bridge Grades, to talk about the one thing American politics is starving for right now: real collaboration. If you are exhausted by tribal “pick a side” thinking, this conversation is a breath of fresh air, because it is not about who is right. It is about who can actually work with people they disagree with.

Brad explains what Bridge Grades is and why he built it. Think of it as a report card for Congress, or like Rotten Tomatoes for politicians. Using objective third-party data, Bridge Grades scores members of Congress from 0 to 100 based on how collaboratively or divisively they govern. The big idea is simple but powerful: ideology and collaboration are independent variables. You can be conservative and still be a bridge-builder. You can be progressive and still be a divider.

We also get into the uncomfortable part. Are citizens rewarding the behaviour they claim they want? Brad talks about how American politics has become identity warfare, and how incentives now favour viral moments, party loyalty, and public dunking over the slow, unglamorous work of governing.

If you are looking for a better way to evaluate politicians beyond red vs blue, this episode will give you a new lens.

Check out Bridge Grades here: https://www.bridgegrades.org/ and tell us what you think. Who are the real bridgers in Congress, and what would it take for voters to start rewarding collaboration at the ballot box?

CHAPTER MARKERS:

00:00 Introduction

01:08 Explaining Bridge Grades

02:44 Brad's Background and Inspiration

06:09 Challenges in Political Engagement

08:46 The Role of Media and Algorithms

19:21 Grading System and Data Sources of Bridge Grades

26:12 Encouraging Bipartisanship

32:09 Exploring Alternatives to the Two-Party System

32:52 The Dream of Normalizing Bridging Politics

33:27 Challenges in Changing Voting Behavior

34:03 The Role of Bridge Grades in Political Campaigns

34:35 Reinviting Disengaged Voters

36:23 The Two-Punch Strategy for Political Change

37:32 Building a Public Utility for Political Transparency

38:16 The Builders Movement and Bridging Efforts

39:00 Evaluating Politicians' Actions and Rhetoric

41:27 Encouraging Bipartisanship in Congress

47:25 Hope for a Collaborative Future in Politics

49:52 Good for the Soul: Live Music and Gen X Memoirs

51:58 Would You Rather

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Bridge Grades:

https://www.bridgegrades.org/

Good For The Soul:

Remember to go and see live music!

https://book-shelfie.com/roll-with-it/

https://liberationbway.com/

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/

We just watched “The Last Republican,” Steve Pink’s new documentary about Adam Kinzinger - the Illinois Congressman who broke ranks with his party after the January 6th hearings, and let’s just say, it sparked a conversation. Actually, several. We’re Nicole (liberal) and Jolene (conservative), friends for nearly 40 years and living proof that you can tackle politics, religion, and money without ending up in a shouting match. In this episode, we give you our take on the film, the politics, and the very human messiness at the heart of it all.

Despite our different political leanings, we came away agreeing on something important: accountability matters, and so does honest conversation about our history. No matter how uncomfortable it is. If we want a better future, we have to be willing to look back, learn, and talk it out, even when it’s messy.

“The Last Republican” isn’t just a documentary about one man or one party, it’s a mirror held up to the state of American politics and an invitation to have the kinds of conversations most people avoid. We hope you’ll watch it, and then talk about it with people who agree with you, and especially with those who don’t. That’s where real understanding starts.

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

The Last Republican Buy Or Rent:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksFrcUdEa9A

Good For the Soul:

Instagram:

@vhsdates

@top.music.songs

www.bridgegrades.org

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/

We’re sharing our take on Ezra Klein’s interview with Yuval Levin and the question it raises about Trump’s presidency: has he achieved as much as it feels like he has, or are we confusing constant motion with durable progress? We talk about why this administration can feel like nonstop action, even when much of that action is not coming through Congress.

A big idea from the Ezra Klein Show conversation is Levin’s framing that Trump governs “retail rather than wholesale.” In other words, prioritizing visible, immediate wins through executive power, pressure, and deal-making, instead of building long-lasting policy through legislation. We unpack why that approach appeals to many voters who wanted a non-politician who would bypass gridlock, and why it also raises concerns about stability when executive orders can be reversed by the next administration.

We also dig into the political reality that Trump’s brand can make bipartisan cooperation in Congress even harder, pushing everyone toward obstruction and performance, and pushing the White House toward even more executive action. The bigger question we leave you with is simple: is Trump adapting to a broken legislative branch, or is this style of leadership making it harder for Congress to function at all?

CHAPTER MARKERS:

00:00 Introduction

00:45 Discussing Listener's Suggestion: Ezra Klein and Yuval Levin

01:58 Trump's First Year: Accomplishments and Controversies

04:00 Debating Congressional vs. Executive Power

05:57 Trump's Approach to Governance

07:59 Media Perception and Legal Battles

18:24 Young Conservatives and Political Extremism

20:51 US Dependency and Federal Funding

22:56 Trump as a Disruptor

23:25 Checks and Balances Concerns

25:58 Media Manipulation and Public Perception

27:01 Trump's Spending and Defense Policies

29:07 Hopes for Congressional Bravery

30:07 America's 250th Birthday

33:28 Good for the Soul: Snowfall and Peace

35:24 TV Show Recommendation: The West Wing

38:31 Would You Rather

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Ezra Klein and Yuval Levin Interview:

https://youtu.be/WJHPaCaMAq4?si=9jnNnea6mPoGj0hf

Senate website/Presidential Nominations Withdrawn: https://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/legislative/one_item_and_teasers/nom_wdr.htm

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/